peace stillearning,
Capitalism-System in which trade and industry are controlled by private owners.
Capitalist-Person who has money invested in business.
Definitions which you seem desperate to know-let me know what you consider is against an Islamic economic system according to the Quran.
Incidentally
You've told me these, I know, I want theoretical backing based on an accepted book for capitalism as Marx's works are for Communism
-I see no description of a CEO/worker relationship in the quran/reading but individual trading is encouraged, the concept of the capitalist class owning the land, factories, machines, etc. is inherently unquranic as it depends on the labor of the working class to make their profit, it is wage-slavery-where people are forced to sell themselves to be used for production and private profit, nobody should "own" the means of production (land, resources, tools, factories, etc) whether private or public ownership as God owns them but a particular group of people should be in charge of distribution and utilization for the best of humanity and that is the righteous, im not gonna lie, this part im still uncertain on, whether it should be the righteous or the people as a whole but regardless neither can be classified as capitalists
-Ok, the concept of investment, it doesnt even make sense, if i put 20 dollars down on a business and the workers increase production my investment value will increase while the wages of the workers stay the same, i did absolutely nothing besides gamble in the stock market and gained money, while those that did the work gained nothing, if you gain money from investment by doing no work, then somebody is working and gaining no money, this falls under the category of riba
-So far I've been arguing how capitalism is different from the quran/reading, pretty soon ill get into how capitalism is the exact opposite of God's system
Agreed-
so no difference between capitalism and Islam then.
Ive been saying that the whole time, the problem with saying there no difference between capitalism and Islam on this is that the excess is to be distributed among the poor and weak of societies while distribution into the economy for goods or investment is no different than "hoarding" as it is still hoarding your money if you use the excess for yourself rather than charity, you seem to think that "hoarding" and being "stingy" is just keeping the money but its also only using it for yourself, excess is allowed in socialism and communism as well but must be given up for the good of humanity
So should evreyone have equal amount of material wealth?
Yes
I misunderstood you again.
k
I never met (until recently) anyone wo did not claim that hadith ewere words of God.
lol far from the same, as many "quran alone muslims" still inherently believe in capitalism without recognizing it, but I guess this all doesn't matter, lets just argue theoretics
No one needs to be poor-but that is different issue and nothing to do with Quran being anti-quranic.
I wish capitalists thought more like you, but im not sure what ur talking about the "to do with Quran being anti-quranic", here are some quotes from capitalist theorists
Defoe argued, in his pamphlet entitled Giving alms no charity and employing charily and employing the poor a grievance to the nation, that:
If the poor were relieved they would remain idle, or alternatively that if they set to work in public institutions, the private manufacturer was equally deprived of his source of labour, the conclusion?expressed in modern term?being that they should be thrown on the market and allowed to starve if they failed to find a place there.
Mandeville pointed the conclusion in his Fable of Bees that:
The poor have nothing to stir them up to be serviceable but their wants, which it is prudence to relieve but folly to cure. To make society happy it is necessary that great numbers should be wretched as well as poor.
In more clear terms, William Townsend declared in his Dissertation on the Poor Laws that:
Hunger will tame the fiercest animals, it will teach decency and civility, obedience and subjugation, to the most perverse. In general, it is only hunger can spur and goad them (the poor) on to labour.
really! I have no idea what you mean.
By the inherent qualities of the righteous/salih described in the reading/quran, the capitalist can never be considered righteous as they do not fit into all the inherent qualities, as simple as that, in fact they are considered kafir because they withhold the blessings of God from humanity-one of the definitions of kafir, plus they fit into descriptions of the kafir in the quran/reading, the righteous willingly distribute their excess to create equality in society while capitalists disrupt the balance through hoarding and greediness creating poverty and inequality, they oppress the people, subjugate the weaker nations, and do all sorts of evil for individual profit, capitalism teaches that the drive for profit and greater profit should have no moral sanctions
Before we go round in circles.
You ave the power to set up an economic system according to Quran.
Tell me what difference you will have from te capitalist system
-No capital allowed to be attained without labor (therefore cutting the CEO/worker relationship, investment for profit, stock market, financial interest, etc.)
-how much one earns should not be determined by the form of job but by how hard one works
-no unequal distribution of wealth or poverty
-no deprivation of basic needs
-no capitalist ownership of the means of production
-etc.
other things based off individual observations-no manipulative advertising, no imperialism, different incentive for work, etc.
Oh by the way(between you and me ) My sympathies are more with socialism-but then that is not what we are discussing here
cool, same here but i tend to go all the way with communism if i could choose man made systems, but as none of them recognize God they are all inherently flawed and will not work in the long run
