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Messages - Layth

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Salam A Submitter,

Thank you. I have made the corrections, except for your last point, which is written correctly in the Quran as "messages".

Salam Timotheus,

I have downloaded your text and updated some of the text (to be in-line with the most recent PDF).

Can you please replace what you have with the below link (please check the formatting as I may have used an older version of your file).


I agree with your post Reel.

My understanding of the verse is to translate as follows:

3:7 He is the One who sent down to you the Book, from which there are legislative verses—they are the Mother of the Book—and others which are comparable. As for those who have a disease in their hearts, they follow that of it which is comparable, seeking to confuse, and seeking to derive an interpretation. But none know its interpretation except God, and those who are well founded in knowledge; they say: "We believe in it, all is from our Lord." And none will remember except those who possess intelligence.

The legislative verses "Hukum" are the essence of the Book and the prime reason it was sent down: do not kill, do not lie, do not eat the meat of pig, etc..

As for the "comparable", they are comparable to the Hukum verses (they seem like laws) when in fact they are not: "obey the messenger, preserve the salat, let women cover, etc..

The twisted people will flock to the "comparable" verses to enforce them as a law when they were never a law (e.g. Saudi Arabia, Iran) and thus distort God's system.

Our story with Lot ends after the town he lived in is destroyed, so no, I don't know where he ended up.


1- The journey from A to B , where is A and where is B?

A: Masjid Haram = Mekka, location of the restricted temple (48:24-25)
B: Masjid Aqsa = Bakka/Jerusalem (land blessed around 17:1, 3:96)

2- How was the journey made? What was the mean of transport?

By the power of God (hence the reference "subhan/glory" to God).

3- How long did the journey take? Was it possible?

Same night (17:1). As for possible, I think it is a forgone conclusion that anything God wants to do is "possible" (raising the dead, etc..).

Also the "farthest Masjid" could be anywhere ( Only mentioned once) ,may be even not on earth? Why or why not?

You could be correct, though I would highlight the description "blessed/mubarak" which is used in a number of other references of a physical place here on Earth (Bakka, the place where Solomon would send the winds, etc.).


When I examine what we have as facts/clues, it paints an interesting picture:

- Abraham is directed towards the location of the shrine by God - 22:26
- The call to pilgrimage is made so that people may attend to the "ancient shrine" 22:29- The shrine at Bakka is called the "first" shrine (implying there is a 2nd?) - 3:96
- The shrine at Bakka has inside it the station/place of Abraham - 3:97
- The shrine at Bakka can be entered - 3:97
- Abraham raises the foundations from an already existing structure - 2:127
- Abraham settles part of his progeny at a site near the "restricted shrine" in a barren valley - 14:37
- Lot is from Abraham's progeny - 6:86
- Lot and Abraham live in two different cities - 29:32
- Lot's town is destroyed, but a part of it was left intact - 29:35
- Mohammed lived in the town of Lot - 37:137-138
- Mohammed lived near the Kaaba "restricted shrine" - 5:97
- Mohammed journey from the "restricted temple" to the "farthest temple" - 17:1
- The "farthest temple" is an area described as "blessed", same description given to the first shrine in Bakka - 3:96

I would therefore say we have:

1. Ancient Shrine/Shrine
2. Restricted Shrine/Shrine

The first is for the pilgrimage, and the 2nd serves as a nearer point for the tribes to give their offerings.

Both Shrines have formed a Temple around them.

1. Al-Aqsa/Farthest Temple
2. Restricted Temple


I would answer that Abraham raised both Temples (one was on its foundations when he arrived, and the other was wiped out completely) - I assume the flood was the reason they were both badly damaged.

Prophecies of the Quran / Re: THE REFORMIST CASE
« on: July 07, 2016, 02:29:08 AM »

I would like to reply to this post since I am associated with the work "Reformist Translation".

The enlightenment of Muslims came through the opening of their minds and the courage to ask and question every aspect of their new religion as well as their world and their history. That Muslims have transgressed into ignorant barbarians who are possibly a few notches below the ignorance of their ancestors who were pagans in Mecca is a direct result of their inability to question, debate, discuss, or tolerate.

The Reformist Translation uses at its core "The Message" which is the translation available on this site. The work is different in that it expands the translation of the text and provides a commentary which speaks of the verses in some detail.

As for the 19 aspect. That there are patterns in the Quran involving various numerical structures is somewhat old news. The Muslims themselves celebrated this pattern in various speeches and booklets (Ahmed Deedat?), so that this becomes a negative at this stage is a bit of a paradox.

As for the other nonsense on the thread - no comment.

General Issues / Questions / Re: alcohal
« on: July 02, 2016, 04:57:29 AM »

Alcohol is permissible if regulated and controlled.

It is not for us to forbid what God has made permissible.


Layl is the absence of light. The break of fast is night, not evening or sunset.

Fajr/Dawn (which is akin to dusk) is agreed by all to be part of the day (Taraf Alnahar), so I don't see why Dusk becomes part of the night when the subject is fasting...


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