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Messages - Bender

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1
Off-Topic / Re: The Music Thread
« on: Today at 10:15:03 AM »
Since my extraordinary and extremely good friend lastday3 still not responded to my utmost humble request to post some more heavenly guitars, I felt I obligated to pollute this thread with some hellish beats from a shaytaan band.
The prodigy - Molotov %$&#

2
Salaam Lastday3,

I didn't check the math but I trust that you have double checked everything before posting.

A lot of people including me are a bit sceptical about predicting past prophecies.
You could take away all my sceptism if you could prophecy something from the quran (or any other book) with any method you like for something that is going to happen in the next 5 years or so.

3
I don't know why my posts in this topic are ignored
I might be wrong but I think the author(s) (Layth?) is/are more interested in technical corrections (missing dots, capitals, misspelling, etc) then in your or my understanding of a particular word.

4
General Issues / Questions / Re: Few Questions
« on: Yesterday at 02:33:32 PM »
How can you call the words of God spam?

It's sad that i was banned for 7 days because of sharing verses from the Gospel.
You had 8 posts in 10 minutes with single verses from the gospels without any comment or explanation, just copy paste.
What if we all do the same with our favorite book, just copy pasting single verses and sentences.
I think a forum is meant for conversations.

5
The most important part of the verse imo is the last part:
وَاللَّـهُ عَزِيزٌ حَكِيمٌ
But hkm has probably nothing to do with justice.

6
Salaam/Peace Bender,
Salaam my most special and most important friend Lastday3   ;)   (I always wondered where the 3 stood for  :hmm).

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how are you doing, dear Friend,
I am fine thank you  :)
How are you? a long time since you spoiled us with your great taste of music (I really mean it).

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it has been a long time you have said (neither positive nor negative) absolutely "nothing" about my posts.
I was to busy with gays and lions raping trees.
I still have the same opinion about your posts. I like your non 19 posts much more than the 19 posts.
I really like numbers but I am to lazy to verify for myself your 19 posts, so most of times I only take a quick glance at them.
I spend much more time studying your non 19 posts  :yes

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So I thought you were completely convinced, happy and content with them, in every aspect of it.  :handshake: 
:D
Well let me put in in this way, I agree with a lot of what you write and the things I am not totally agreeing with you are not that important.

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So you should absolutely know, my dear Friend, that I really hate the drama
but, inshaAL-LAH, always straightforwardly, clearly and openly tell the Truth as it is.
So you should reflect on what I say in my posts thoroughly and deeply at least "twice"  :peace: , please,
before assuming "drama" in/into them.     

And please, never forget that this is not my native language here, first of all;
and please, also never expect the Messenger to be perfect in its delivery (remember Moses here, who could not 
talk "eloquently / properly" =43/51-52),
and remember Muhammad here, who had no formal education and never talked in "academic / scholarly" language,
at all (=25/41 & 43/31), 
but they always talked from the heart and mind and absolutely told the Truth, in their own way/style, as they
perfectly received it from AL-LAH therein).
No I really like it, I am a drama queen myself  ;)
Seriously, you should not change the way you write, would be not honest to yourself AND most importantly and absolutely critical you will loose a big fan  :)

7
the book is amazing... provide hints/signs lot of times..

the verse we are dealing is 2: 282
just move one number from right to left like this .. 2:228 now see whats there...

وللرجال عليهن درجة والله عزيز حكيم

But the men will have a degree over them. God is Noble, Wise.

i request from lastday and all to reinterprete it... i also feel unjustice here with address to womens..  :&

God is wise and noble no doubt about it . and there is a reason behind every decision and command what he made for his servants..

at the face value its sounds to me a degree/darja of waiting period...  but again whatsoever the topic is its confirmed that the male have degree instead of females.. i hope we can reinterpret darja/degree as equal so that interpretation will be fit..

 :group:

وَلِلرِّجَالِ عَلَيْهِنَّ دَرَجَةٌ
walilrrijali AAalayhinna darajatun

With the li the "AAalayhinna" is referring to the rijaal themselves.
But how is that possible? AAalayhinna is feminine, and rijaal is masculine.
Maybe in this case we should neglect that and insist that it should be understood that men have degrees over women.

8
I love the drama in your posts  :)
most Essential and exclusive, most specific, exact Date, most shocking tragic Event in modern history of humankind,  clearly anticipated and also strongly emphasized  O0

9
General Issues / Questions / Re: Homosexuality LGBTQI and the deen
« on: December 03, 2016, 05:49:17 PM »
Bender,

The reason I brought up that thread (which involved your method of understanding Quran) was because in this thread your method of understanding Quran came up again. It's simple.

In that old thread you were shown to be using an unproven method to govern how you interpret Quran - sounds dodgy to me. I felt in this thread you were doing the same thing, hence discussing testing your method - if possible.
Does any one here has a proven method?

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Agreed BUT if your method is found lacking multiple times then we may be able to conclude your method may be weak/suspect.
I see it differently, I think the method I use is the best there is, but it's me who is lacking skills.

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You're against benefits? Weird.

I assume you are referring to the "benefits" of being able to choose another meaning when our understanding doesn't fit - a suspect "benefit" hence your use of " ". If so, I wasn't even on about that hence why I referred to clarification.
RED: pedophiles, murderers, slaveholders, oppressors, thieves, etc also make use of those benefits.
I prefer correctness over benefits.

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Forget Quran, forget Arabic, have you even considered how in a language, any language, synonyms can actually help clarify? THINK.
Maybe there are some benefits from poetic point of view, but besides that I don't see any benefit.

I was watching a serie last week.
The bad guy Boyd Crowder held a man hostage, when he was done questioning him, he said to his sidekick Colt: "Take care of him"
So Colt shot the hostage in the head.
Boyd actually meant for Colt to untie the hostage, and then reflects that he will have to be more careful with his choice of words next time.
I believe the language of the quran should be clean, it should not allow such misunderstandings.

btw great serie, Boyd Crowder is  O0

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If one were to limit the scope of variation by utilising a robust checklist to check whenever one wants to choose a different meaning of the same word then that would certainly reduce variant interpretations, e.g. the same word could mean a different thing in another occurrence BUT only if:
1) the dominant meaning in the other occurrences has been tested extensively in this occurrence under question and found problematic (by intra-Quran analysis)
2) AND there is an intra-Quran logical reason for choosing another meaning, e.g. an illogical outcome results
3) AND this other meaning has some basis in Classical Arabic dictionaries or at least theory
4) AND this other meaning fits a pattern, e.g. if its with a certain preposition, part of an idiom, all other occurrences fit like a glove
5) AND obviously this meaning does not contradict anything anywhere else in Quran

And don't worry if you don't understand what I mean by the above, here is the method I try to stick to: http://www.quran434.com/study-method.html

Generally, I prefer to use explicit methods of understanding Quran, e.g. those said in Quran itself (see link above), rather than making up interpretational rules then using these made up rules to understand Quran. If that's what others want to do, then good luck in that minefield.

Each to their own.

I respect your method and it will bring for sure only positive results for people who use the quran quotes you quoted in your link.

10
General Issues / Questions / Re: Homosexuality LGBTQI and the deen
« on: December 02, 2016, 07:13:05 AM »
I never thought so and I even explicitly said this in the very link I referenced.
I thought I read something else there...

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No.

I agree, your example is irrelevant and proves nothing.
Ok, then you really lost me now.
I thought when you brought up synonyms and even a link to an old thread were you gave the next example, you wanted to discuss synonyms.
- idrib bi AAasaka al hajara fa infajarat min hu  [2:60]
- idrib bi AAasaka al hajara fa inbajasat min hu [7:160]
But I guess I am wrong.
So before I make the same mistake, can you please clarify why you were talking about synonyms and homonyms and why the reference to a 4 years old thread if that was not what you wanted to discuss?


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I disagree. We can easily test methods to see which ones are consistent, lead to logical/practical results, and perhaps even falsify some. Methods (for various things) are tested all the time.
I welcome every feedback or correction

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Have you even considered the potential benefits of synonyms (in terms of clarifying)?
Well the potential "benefits" are exactly the reason why I am against synonyms.

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It's real simple, and I already implied how, we insert "beating" into the Quran occurrences and whenever it results in an illogical/impractical/contradiction (if any) I ask you to explain it. If you cant make it make sense your method fails.

Not my method fails but my understanding of that word fails.
And this is what I am doing for years, see if undersatnding x fits everywhere, if not then I try to come up with a better defintion.
A loooooooooooot of defintions failed by this method but not the method itself.


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Of course there will be an element of subjectivity to it, e.g. you may think your translation of a certain verse makes sense, whereas I do not. That's fine, but evidence needs to be put on the table first before we can test/decide anything.
yes this is testing defintions not methods.

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If you are ready to put the results on the table, let's begin. Please confirm your answers for all 4, or if you want, we can do one at a time. Please confirm your actual understanding of the root DRB and verb DaRaBa.
I seriously do not get the point of this, except if you want to see if my understanding of a particular word is consistent everywhere or not.

I admit that my approach does not bring a lot of results, this means that I have for a loooooooooooooot of words/verses no clue, but I am confident that this is the way to go as I believe that this approach will lead to a better understanding.
Allowing homonyms and synonyms will for sure bring a lot of results, but it allows also a lot of different interpretations, and I am confident that this is the wrong approach.

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MofF has already ran away, so it's just you.
I guess he is wiser than me.

Is every discussion here a game of thrones?

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